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Post by oswlek on Nov 5, 2012 13:25:36 GMT -5
EDIT: NEW FINAL?..picosong.com/3RG4picosong.com/3FmSPut this together this morning. Everything you hear is a one-take wonder, so it'll all need to be retracked, I just wanted to scrap some ideas together. In my head the horn sounded so much better than it does here, so I'm hoping to get some feedback on whether the horn could work (with better velocity/automation/EQ/etc) or if it detracts too much from the delicate verse. Or if it works in some spots, but not in others. picosong.com/3nwwUpdated lyrics This house is haunted
By every word we said
By every thing we did
Or should have done
I only wanted
To stroke your auburn hair
And whisper one more prayer
FOR[/b] you (sung wrong) Everywhere I turn, there you are This house is haunted I feel you in the air I'm drifting off somewhere With you Everywhere I turn, there you are[/i] Some news and notes: * The entrance of the horn off the first chorus is very sloppy. Please overlook that and just focus on how it sounds as a lead interlude * The strings are too low and the backing vox at the end is too up front. * I'm expecting some perc to come in on the final chorus. Light tapping at first and then a little more when the vocals surge upward (though probably never a full kit). Thanks for the help! 
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Post by leeknight on Nov 5, 2012 14:07:38 GMT -5
This is pretty freaking awesome. Your voice... man. wow. Um... no, that sound isn't good enough. The songs too good. But you know, I thought it was an accordion at first. And that made me think this below and how you might go for that absinthe soaked children of the Parisian nightime underground sort of spooky dooky vibe.
I'd go very easy with something that has no attack. Listen here...
You keep getting better and better.
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Post by oswlek on Nov 5, 2012 14:18:11 GMT -5
Thanks, Lee. The vocals are actually quite terrible - I must have tuned 40 notes and did so in a quick and dirty fashion - I've just finally figured out how to make it sit right.  I was thinking I should use something like you recommend, but thought it would be too much like the other stuff I've been mixing. Was trying to be different, which I guess isn't going to work here.  How about the placement of the sounds? Assuming I get a better sound (and I might even go organic with guitars for some of it) is the layout acceptable? FWIW, I'm pretty sold on the post-C1 interlude as well as what the lead is doing at the very end of the song. I'm really looking at the opening bit and the parts that come in at 1:13/2:27 as being the most up-in-the-air. |
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Post by leeknight on Nov 5, 2012 14:37:18 GMT -5
I dig your arrangement. Yeah. It's just those pesky attack portions of sounds. You could try dialing the attack back so you get a swell into each note. Put a timed 1/4 delay and it might be cool. Like the Melotron work (actually Chamberlain) by Michael Penn's sideman, or that awesome lead sampler sound by Peter Murphy? What wast hat song... Cuts You up. You need something either bellows powered or something that emulates the attack of a bow.
Listen to how this attack portion swells into the note. Then a vibrato feeds the nice delay. Nice and warm without attack.
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Post by oswlek on Nov 5, 2012 15:06:04 GMT -5
Alright, I'll see what I can do about the attack. Then we'll see if the brass sound is problematic in and of itself.
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Post by oswlek on Nov 5, 2012 15:19:38 GMT -5
Oh, forgot to say that I'm interested in lyric feedback. I had been kicking around a few different options and ultimately decided to marry the two of them, using Len's second verse and dropping "our song was playing" for "I only wanted'.
Working?
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Post by mrkelley on Nov 5, 2012 15:26:18 GMT -5
The lyric is perfect as is.
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Post by oswlek on Nov 5, 2012 16:01:42 GMT -5
Sweet! Thanks, LCK, that settles that!
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Post by oswlek on Nov 8, 2012 13:25:22 GMT -5
This has been totally reworked. Gone is the horn, replaced mostly by guitar along with a subtle cello in some spots. A Rhodes piano has been added to play into the creepiness of the verse, though I need to rewrite what it does in V1, as well as a normal piano to fill out the final chorus. I retracked the vox with a better intonation take, but I don't think I captured the feeling well enough, so it will almost certainly be done again. The mix is a long way off (noise, panning, automation, etc) but I think I've gotten it to a point that it is worth posting here. Especially if you think it needs to veer in a different direction!  picosong.com/3FmSYes, the vocals suck, but am I diving too deep into the musical cheese?  |
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Post by bee3 on Nov 8, 2012 14:28:25 GMT -5
Only listened to the newest version... sounds good. Definitely need to work on the vox in the chorus... but you probably know that already. And yeah... the way you sung "FOR"... so anti-Pattison. |
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Post by oswlek on Nov 8, 2012 14:31:17 GMT -5
Only listened to the newest version... sounds good. Definitely need to work on the vox in the chorus... but you probably know that already. And yeah... the way you sung "FOR"... so anti-Pattison. Well, there are only two words and "you" gets more treatment, but I think you are right that it would sound better if I shorten "for" a little. Yeah, I will be totally redoing the vox because the entire thing just isn't strong enough. At this point, I'm really looking for help seeing if the music feels right. |
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Post by oswlek on Nov 8, 2012 17:07:53 GMT -5
Starting to worry that the general apathy with this one means I am missing the mark somehow.
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Post by bee3 on Nov 8, 2012 17:40:09 GMT -5
Sorry... Crazy busy... Wife is away... 3 kids...
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Post by oswlek on Nov 8, 2012 17:48:33 GMT -5
Sorry... Crazy busy... Wife is away... 3 kids... What are you apologizing for? Isn't that your comment a few spots above? |
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Post by oldgitplayer on Nov 8, 2012 19:19:28 GMT -5
At this point, I'm really looking for help seeing if the music feels right. If listened to both versions, and these are my thoughts on the instrumentation of the most recent version : Overall, the choice of instruments feels right - I prefer it to the previous horns. The one part that feels quite wrong is the bit of electric guitar at 3.20. Overall, I was feeling the minimal approach went on for too long. What are your thoughts on introducing the acoustic rhythm guitar at 'Everywhere' 1.20 in the same way as the Outro 'Everywhere'? |
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Post by oswlek on Nov 8, 2012 19:51:14 GMT -5
At this point, I'm really looking for help seeing if the music feels right. If listened to both versions, and these are my thoughts on the instrumentation of the most recent version : Overall, the choice of instruments feels right - I prefer it to the previous horns. The one part that feels quite wrong is the bit of electric guitar at 3.20. Overall, I was feeling the minimal approach went on for too long. What are your thoughts on introducing the acoustic rhythm guitar at 'Everywhere' 1.20 in the same way as the Outro 'Everywhere'? Thanks for the reply. Do you mean the very outro, with the humming? Or are you saying the playing in the second chorus? I ask because there are three separate ways, so would you be willing to tell me the time when that style comes in? I'm thinking about introducing a bass at some point, so that might help with the minimal issue. I'll also see what I can do about the guitar at the end. I like the "lead" feel of it, but it does start a little abruptly. |
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Post by unclenny on Nov 8, 2012 20:04:40 GMT -5
This tune is a bit different.....it develops slowly. I think you will make or break this one with your vocals. You will need to nail the final performance. |
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Post by oldgitplayer on Nov 8, 2012 21:02:15 GMT -5
Do you mean the very outro, with the humming? Or are you saying the playing in the second chorus? I ask because there are three separate ways, so would you be willing to tell me the time when that style comes in? I'm thinking about introducing a bass at some point, so that might help with the minimal issue. I'll also see what I can do about the guitar at the end. I like the "lead" feel of it, but it does start a little abruptly. The acoustic rhythm starts at 2.30 with 'Everywhere' - Maybe this rhythm can also be at 1.16 'Everywhere'. It's fairly gentle, so I don't think it will be intrusive. Yes - the bass may help fill it out. I think the guitar at the end just sounds wrong. The tone interrupts the mood you have established with the other instrumentation. |
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Post by oswlek on Nov 9, 2012 10:00:01 GMT -5
Thanks OGP. I really like the initial chorus guitar, but you are right. In my head I've voiced some of the picking with piano and it sounds nice.
I've written a bass line in my head while driving to work, hopefully it sticks around by the time I get to it this weekend.
I'm certain that electric guitar is how that lead part should be. I probably just need to back off the distortion a little, and I also need to tweak it so the attack isn't so strong on the notes. If they faded in slightly it won't sound so sudden and out of place.
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Post by leeknight on Nov 9, 2012 10:02:20 GMT -5
Yes! Beautiful. Really great stuff. nice work on the keys additions.
I think you've nailed this one, with the exception of some vocal tuning/technique issues. You've got the choice of "tuning" or trying to sing those bit with good breath support and open vowels.
It's a hard thing, man. Singing a song so soft and atmospheric, and needing to get proper breath support too without over singing/over blowing the tone and feel. And you haven't over sung/overblown it at all.
you've under supported your tone. So you could "tune" it, but the mild tone issues of not being open enough and support that open tone with enough breath support will still be there.
This is really good, I'd be tempted to take 4 or 5 more passes on the trouble bits and try getting maximum breath support while not overblowing. Loop it and practice your breath technique.
Or you could just tune it and be done with it. Which I will admit is very, very tempting and something I've done myself at times.
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Post by leeknight on Nov 9, 2012 10:03:38 GMT -5
I should mention that you absolutely NAIL the vocal issues most of the time. You know where those bits are so I'm not going to detail it all out. Just get the weak bits as good as the best bits. Easy! right? |
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Post by oswlek on Nov 9, 2012 10:10:25 GMT -5
Thanks, Lee. So you aren't bothered by that electric guitar at the end as much as OGP?
I am going to completely redo the vocals. I agree that I didn't quite pull off the emotion and I think I know why. Rather than singing along with a piano melody track, I was tracking along with a tuned vocal. I got lazy and didn't realize how much it affected my delivery until afterward. Never going to do that again.
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Post by leeknight on Nov 9, 2012 10:21:41 GMT -5
I personally don't have any issues with any of the arrangement. I'm not saying the suggestions might not be great, but I'm mostly fixated on the vocal performance and what it will mean to this song. That is really ALL of it for me on this one. Sounds like you're on it.
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Post by oswlek on Nov 9, 2012 14:24:24 GMT -5
After retracking the guitar and vocals, I'll probably polish the current direction up, but I can't shake the feeling that "Haunted" might sound cool modeled after this:
I actually have some ideas for the verse, but the chorus trips me up. It almost sounds like it would want to drop off entirely and be a cappella, at least the first time....
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Post by oswlek on Nov 11, 2012 16:29:00 GMT -5
Stayed up to 5:00 a.m. putting this together and despite being completely exhausted right now, I'm feeling pretty good about it. The vocals have been completely retracked with 4 exceptions, which were comped from the very first take. Even though there is some tuning artifact, I just love the way the line was delivered, so I left it in. The majority of the vocal is true, comped. OGP won't be happy with me because I left the first verse guitar alone and I kept the electric lead. I did make major tweaks to make each feel more appropriate, though. In the first chorus, a piano comes in and adds the growth he wanted from the guitar. At the end, the song is much more developed, making the lead part feel more appropriate. One of the coolest things I did with this was to add a reverse lead at the end. It isn't a normal reverse, akin to "Rain", it really just smears the lead in with the rest of the mix. So, what say you? Is this an acceptable final? picosong.com/3RG4This house is haunted
By every word we said
By every thing we did
Or should have done
I only wanted
To stroke your auburn hair
And whisper one more prayer
For you
Everywhere I turn, there you are
This house is haunted
I feel you in the air
I'm drifting off somewhere
With you
Everywhere I turn, there you are |
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Post by stickboy on Nov 11, 2012 16:41:00 GMT -5
WOW! Love the instrumentation and your voice sounds excellent!
If i was going to be critical of "anything" Id say either lose the hum at the very end OR replace with a high "ohh ohh ohh" OR replace with an instrument playing that hum melody
More than an "acceptable" final though
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Post by oldgitplayer on Nov 11, 2012 17:37:02 GMT -5
OGP won't be happy with me because I left the first verse guitar alone and I kept the electric lead. I did make major tweaks to make each feel more appropriate, though. In the first chorus, a piano comes in and adds the growth he wanted from the guitar. At the end, the song is much more developed, making the lead part feel more appropriate. My happiness is of no consequence. The main thing is you have arrived at where you want to be with the song. I think the piano in the 1st chorus works perfectly. It does everything I was looking for to fill out the sparseness just a little. I still think there might be a better solution to the small passage of lead guitar near the end. I don't think the tone fits with the overall song. But other than that, I really like it, and the quality of your vocal is the big highlight that grabs the attention. Great work. |
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Post by oswlek on Nov 12, 2012 7:41:34 GMT -5
Thanks guys. This one threatened to get away from me a few times, but somewhere around 2:00 in the morning I knew it was finally captured. Stick - I initially stuck the humming in there as a placeholder for a 12 string, but came to like it. My mom said it was one of her favorite parts when she listened to the earlier demo. OGP - I hear you about the guitar, and I did cut a good deal of the mids out of the first version, so it isn't so in your face, but I couldn't find anything else and it doesn't bother me as it is. Thanks for helping sculpt this, I probably would have left the first chorus alone had it not been for your comment, and I was even able to fiddle my way into a cool piano part in the second stanza of V1 because of it. |
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Post by leeknight on Nov 12, 2012 11:32:14 GMT -5
Beautifuller... your voice has just gotten so much better. And this song (it's wonderful) really showcases your newfound chops as a hair metal belter! No... as a singer who can deliver a mood and emotion with style and aplomb. Nicely done!!!
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Post by bee3 on Nov 12, 2012 11:40:40 GMT -5
Wow.
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